Random thoughts after camp-meeting
juni 6th, 2009
So I just went to the ‘camp-meeting’ of the Adventist church in Norway (where, by the way, I’m staying for the summer). For those that don’t know what this is, it is where many members of the Adventist Church get together for sort of a day of fellowship.
First thought: It was nice. For various reasons, it’s been a couple of weeks since I last had the opportunity to worship with other believers, and that was really nice. Raafat Kamal – known better to some of us as Nat’s dad – gave a very forceful talk about the mission of the church, especially touching on the way we deal with people. Spot on.
Second thought (why am I putting this in bullet-point fashion?): It seems to me – it may not be so though, cf. a conversation I had in the car on the way back, but still, it seems to me – that often we can classify people in our church as belonging to two groups: Those that have their focus on the here and now and those that have their clear focus on his second coming. Within the Adventist Church, with our background and tradition, the latter translates to having a heavy focus on our being in the end time, the coming trials, the call to come out of her (interpretations of Rev 18.4), historical prophecies, and the signs of the times. The latter group seems to be more ‘mainstream’ in their Christian thinking, and generally (i) focus less on these things, while (ii) focusing more on the difference God can make in their lives here and now, the walk with God, the kingdom of God being at hand, and so on (if this group speak of the second coming, it is usually in quite general, more mainline, terms, and not as a focus-point; it’s just part of the bagage). Many times when people step up to the platform to sing a song, contribute with their thoughts, or take part in a debate, I get the feelings they are likely to belong to one of these groupings. I also get the feeling that the directions in which these groups are heading are not the same.
It would be nice to see a synthesis, or a direction that would maintain both, of these two foci – the here and now and the second coming / eternal life – if nothing else, because it seems that both Jesus and Paul managed to have them coexist in their thinking and doing and life. True, this picture is stylised, and I also see a more healthy middle ground in the church, but this seems a minority. I don’t have the answer on how to do it – my theology is probably flawed as well – but I recognise the need within our church for some sort of integration. Much of what has seemed integration up to this point to me does not seem so, since there is often still a lack of focus on the kingdom of God among us, as especially laid out by Jesus in the Gospel of Mark (forgive me if my labelings are not entirely consistent or my thinking not crystal-clear; I hope it still makes sense on some plane of thought). The music program did a good job of trying to integrate though. That was quite good.
Third thought: I have been able to be near – in different settings during the day – a small number of ‘core families’ that seemed to be working very well. It’s funny how you can usually tell when you come into the presence of such a family – the way they interact, the way they treat each other, the implicit respect the parents enjoy from, while not commanding of, the children. Simply a good solid family. Yes, solid is the word. Not coming from such a family myself, I may be more prone to picking up the difference. Whenever I meet people my age who has grown up in a solid family like this, our whole instinctive feeling about marriage seem to be completely opposite. For me, it has been interesting to note that for some people, it would be a strange and foreign thought to worry about the ‘what if’’s and the potential problems (true, some of it may be personality-related, but still I see a pattern). They simply assume, by instinct or experience, that things will work out fine.
Fourth thought: Norway is a really beautiful country. Driving up to Tyrifjord is simply amazing.
Entry Filed under: Church, Family, Life, Reflections, Theology
12 Comments Add your own
1. Stine Winkler | juni 7th, 2009 at 07:59
Om tanke tre: Hvem tror du har størst sandsynlighed for at få et godt familieliv i fremtiden – de der antager, at det nok skal gå eller de, der tænker “hvad nu hvis”?
Om tanke to: Interessant måde at opdele folk på, ikke en tanke jeg har tænkt før. Men kan godt følge dig… (og blev også lidt ramt selv)
2. raabjerg | juni 7th, 2009 at 09:23
Stine,
on #3: I was wondering about this yesterday as well (who would be most likely to have a good family life in the future), and it would be interesting to look up statistics. Which I have not done, so right now, it’s pure speculation. However, I believe kids from divorced families (all other things being equal) are more likely to divorce themselves in the future (as suggested in http://www.jyi.org/news/nb.php?id=352). I was also wondering yesterday if those with a broken background are more likely to marry later, but I can’t quite make up my mind on what I would speculate here
on #2: Glad you could recognise it somehow. Especially since you (as far as I know) come from a different church background. So where are you in the picture?
3. Stine Winkler | juni 7th, 2009 at 09:43
Om 3: En af mine veninder er skilsmissebarn og gentager ofte sig selv og siger: “you model what you know”. Som et argument for, at hun selv har en højere sandsynlighed for at ende i en skilsmisse end mig, der kommer fra en familie med ulideligt lykkelige forældre (nyforelskede siden 1975…)
Om hun har ret, er jeg ikke klar over. Jeg tror der er en styrke i at vide hvor nogle af faldgruberne er, så man kan arbejde på at undgå dem.
Er skilsmisseprocenten mon højere i ens andet, tredje, fjerde (fortsæt selv) ægteskab end i det første? For det ville da være en fin indikator for om man lærer af sine fejl.
Om 2: Jeg er nemlig ikke adventist, det har du ret i. Selvom jeg sikkert godt kunne være det, da jeg klart primært skal placeres i den gruppe, der har fokus på Jesu andet komme, frem for hvad Gud kan give mig lige nu…
Burde jeg i øvrigt kommentere på engelsk?
4. raabjerg | juni 7th, 2009 at 17:58
Hehe, you’re free to comment in Danish if you have a preference for it. Otherwise, I’d suggest you comment in English for the greater good
Interesting points you raise.
5. Stine Winkler | juni 7th, 2009 at 22:04
“The grater good” is that you non-Danish readers? And are there many. Or have you just been in Britain for so long, that Danish no longer is your native tounge?
I’m quite good at english, so it’s possible for me to comment in english (despite the fact that I use way to many commas). Det er bare som om fingrene skriver på dansk, hvis de kan få lov!
Thanks for finding my points interesting, I take it you have nothing to add, but simply agree on my observations
6. Lasse Bech | juni 8th, 2009 at 11:22
Jonas, you obviously wasn’t at the camp meeting in Western Norway which was at the same time. I think your 2nd concern of a synthesis between the two was what the speaker there was trying to adress.
7. raabjerg | juni 8th, 2009 at 17:47
The speaker being you I gather
I would think you would be one of the people to do just that… 
(Stine, you may take it as you wish :p)
8. Stian Riedmann | juni 9th, 2009 at 08:02
Nice to see your blog is alive
Raafat Kamal, was also at the danish camp meeting – i talked to him a bit and when he found out you were my brother his first comment was “you dont have the same hair” (or something like that)
just thougt i would let you know
9. Stian Riedmann | juni 9th, 2009 at 10:20
Hey and by the way – it was actually the second thing Raafat said – the first thing he said was “Jonas has never mentioned you”, but he had heard about both Benjamin and Pernille – am i like the black sheep of the family or what
About your third thought, i think it is both a personality thing and a background thing. since we come from the same family, i think i can say your personality are maybe more prone to worrying, even though i horrifyingly have found out lately that we are maybe more alike than i have realized earlier
)
But i am pretty sure coming from our background, and beeing aware of our parents mistakes, and maybe analyzing both them and other families, and beeing aware of how you can create a healthy relationship and family life, will affect the chance of divorce in a positive way.
Besides that i think the one most important thing to succed in marriage, is to do what Jesus says and “love your neighbour like yourself” in this case your wife or husband. If you really love your wife, and are not just in the relationship for your own sake, i am certain that will be the best foundation for a marriage (just a theory though as i have not tried it out in real life
10. raabjerg | juni 15th, 2009 at 20:03
You are wise beyond your years, little brother
11. Stian Riedmann | juni 16th, 2009 at 22:29
are u mocking me? if no, thanks – if yes, im gonna tell mom so she can make you stop.
12. raabjerg | juni 17th, 2009 at 04:51
Why, you little.. No, I wasn’t mocking!
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